Why German men don’t flirt
By Karsten on Saturday, 2008-04- 5, 01:07 - Berlin but sexy - Permalink
This post is also available in: German FrenchI’ve been living in Germany for a year now. So far, the closest I have come to being chatted up was when, out of the blue, I found myself at the receiving end of a stream of lager-fuelled verbal abuse. I only hope that this wasn’t supposed to be a chat-up line.
by Anna Patton
Of course, I’d be willing to accept that the problem lies with me – I’m no Angelina Jolie, after all, and I don’t even own a push-up bra. Indeed, I did assume the fault was my own, until I realised I wasn’t the only one to have experienced such blatant indifference to my feminine charms. For, as it turns out, every girl I know in this city has suffered the same disinterest. Fiona*, who’s been living here for 2 years, wasn’t at all surprised when I suggested that it was difficult to get to know men in Berlin: “Oh absolutely, you have to be really pushy here – German men never make the first move.” And Carola told me that in all her life, she had never once been chatted up by a German man: she is a native Berliner. Men here simply do not approach strangers.
And I’m not even being very demanding here. After all, my standards are based on the charming yet mostly hopeless British / Irish culture, where flirting mostly consists of clumsily sidling up to a girl at the bar and stuttering something incomprehensible, or later on, perhaps, drunkenly lunging at her on the dance floor. My flirtatious encounters to date have been mostly unmemorable and rarely romantic. (The low point would have to be: “I like the way your hair blows in the breeze”. We were sitting in the living room at the time.) But even those goofy lines or leery gestures, cringe-worthy as they are, give you something to work with, and at least let you know where you stand. In Germany, that serious-looking man sitting just over there may be passionately in love with you, and you would never know.
Victims of Venustraphobia
So what is actually going on here? Is it that German men don’t want to flirt – or is it a matter of being physically unable to do so? Some kind of genetic thing, much in the way white people can’t rap and Europeans can’t dance? Did the emergence of the Italian Stallion and French charmer all those centuries ago cause the German species to evolve in the other direction – nature’s way of balancing things out for the women of Europe?
The evidence of a German incapacity to flirt is rife, at least on an anecdotal level. The numerous “flirt schools” and flirting workshops across the country would barely survive the close of a business day somewhere in the Med. And recently, an article that appeared in several publications compared flirting habits across cultures. German men, it found, “see the conquest of German women as an extreme sport…. The charm thing doesn’t really come into it”. Clearly German men aren’t much into their high-risk sports; according to the author, they may even be victims of “Venustraphobia” – the fear of chatting up beautiful women. Some see this fear as having been provoked by an excessively emancipated female population, who have now taken over the predator role in the sexual hunting game.
Scoring a German
But could it simply be a matter of men behaving in the way that society expects them to? German women, it is claimed, expect their menfolk to show restraint. The Spiegel Online, in the run-up to the German World Cup in 2006, provided some guidelines for foreign fans looking to “score a German” after the game. Would-be seducers should be cautious, it warned, since saying hello to a German lady “comes across as overly forward”. Saying hello? What is this, the 19th century? The Deutsche Welle, offering advice to international students on the subject of flirting, also advises caution. Apparently, “eye contact and good manners” will get you much further than “exaggerated macho posturing”. It seems the definition of flirting auf Deutsch is still limited to a stony-faced stare from across the room.
So why don’t men here flirt? Partly it’s about conforming to standards: getting a wolf whistle as you walked down Unter den Linden would be a bit much. But I don’t believe any German woman could justifiably be offended by being approached by a friendly stranger – that’s just an excuse. Basically, men are afraid to make fools of themselves, because that’s precisely the risk that flirting entails, and Germans don’t go in for risks. They like to do things properly and thoroughly, not spontaneously or irrationally. Forget genetic predisposition, or even cultural conditioning. Germans just aren’t into extreme sports. Although, come to think of it, I’ve never been one for the adrenalin rush either. Perhaps it’s time I checked out one of those flirting seminars?
*Names have been changed
Comments
Hi Anna, thats pretty much a brilliant analysis of the situation. I am a German, originally from a city close to Cologne and I would never flirt with a zoologist. Kidding! I do think it depends on the place you go to. Give Kaffee Burger a chance on sunday nights. You wont regret.
I agree with you - especially with the conclusion "Germans don´t go for risks". I tell you a joke - some suppose it is about the famous Berliner Tempo, said to be fast!
A man flirt with a woman. After 30 seconds he says: "Young Lady, I am a man of speedy decisions. You shine into my eyes, may I kiss you?" She says: "Well at first I wasnt too sure, but then you convinced me!"
Some say it is about German romantic attitude - finding love at first side. Check out the book THE GERMANS by Gordon E. Craig. Its fucking brilliant. Or send me a message and come over for coffee please!
hey Anna ,
I just incidentally came across your post and I couldn't pass it by without expressing my concern about this issue.
Finally someone to put this well-known true black and white .
My stay in Germany ( Hannover ) completely confirms that anthropological phenomen. Here the arguments:
- I'm female, single, jung, not Anjelina Jolie , but still attractive;
-I've been to others countries also and I know many men from others nationalities.
-and I can say , there are nowhere species like the German man to find (fortunately).
Not only they wouldn't treat you like a sexual object, but they would act like they are too busy to lose they time picking up a girl . Or worse, they think that will affect you somehow. I wounder how they get married here . It's this the beginning of a new unisex generation , having in mind the further self-dependence of the women.
I'm not sure I want this.
I still want to be chatted by drunk boys in smoky clubs, though I would always first laught at them .
finally, that's our nature...
they have to change, otherwise all the girls here will immigrate to Spain or some other place with bigger chance to continue their kind.
ahahahahahahahahaah
great anna
:-D
You are spot on here!
But - dont forget the big advantage of German men. They mean what they say and when they tell you they will call - they do!! And if they say they love you - chances are they do.
Rather have this any day than the average British bloke who says anything to get what they want...
p.s. my tip is asking them to show you round the town they live in at night - even Germans let their guard down after a few Hefeweisen!
Anna,
If you see a nice guy you like the look of and are frustrated that he has not come over to talk to you, why not go over to talk to him? He may not have noticed you.
Generally speaking, if you want something and don't say or do anything, you won't get it. And you will still be wondering why german guys don't flirt, when you could be flirting with one.
Sad to say but the age of white knights in shining armour whisking you away to their nice Schloss is over...
If you want some baby, you gotta go get it... ;-x
Hi! Sorry, I have to disagree. I live in Michigan in all of the German guys flirt with girls at the bar. I always been lucky with the germans. ;-)
Anna,
i totally agree with you. although I'm a lil bit young. ive had further encounters with british and spanish guys and let me tell you i got lucky with both of them just by giving them sexy eyes. BUT when it comes about german guys idk what to do. i mean it's like they had to know the girl from his whole entire life to talk to her or to get on with her. it suckss so bad. im very very attractive and have lots of sex appeal but german guys are so idk innocent. ugh. they are nice for long term relationships but when it comes about a "night of innocent fun" they just dont go for it. why's that? i mean whats their problem? im going to germany for 3 months this summer and id loveeeeeeeeee to have some fun. but im affraid german guys wont approach me. they should be more outgoing.
Wow, this article was right on the money!
I'm a German native but I live in the states now and I'm not planning on going back. I just love how men treat women over here. They know how to flirt and be considerate (yes, I do like it when a man opens the door for me). And it's not just American men, Hispanics and different Latin cultures are pretty good at making a women feel special as well.
With German Guys it's just like pulling teeth. Even if you know the guy likes you, he's still not going to make any moves. German men don't even know how to give a decent compliment to a woman and have no clue about the art of smooth talking. I think it's a lost cause!